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My Enchanting is at level 100, and I have:

  • Enchanter (5/5)
  • Fire Enchanter
  • Insightful Enchanter
  • Corpus Enchanter
  • Extra Effect

Here is a chart of the effect:

              (tested) (tested)   (theoretical) (theoretical)      (actual)
Glass Boots:  base     base+grand Elixir(*1.25) +Necromage(*1.31)  Actual
resist fire   +15%     +46%       +58%          +60%               +54%
regen stamina +10%     +31%       +39%          +40%               +36%

Game version is 3.10.0.

The end result is approximately a 17% boost to enchanting; even an Enchanter's Philter (+20%) should be better.

user19087
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1 Answers1

20

These results are correct, it's just that the potions are affecting your base skill rather than directly affecting enchantment strength. Enchanting's base skill has a particularly weak* effect on things (and it's non-linear, so only a fraction of that +x% manifests in enchantment strength); it's all about the perks.

The formula is

net magnitude = base magnitude * soul multiplier * skill multiplier *
                (1 + Enchanter perk) * (1 + specific perk modifier)

where skill multiplier is "approximately"

skill multiplier = 1 + (skill / 100) * (skill / 100 - 0.14) / 3.4

It is the above skill value that enchantments affect, not the net magnitude. Therefore, your skill multiplier should be

skill multiplier = 1 + 1.25 * (1.25 - 0.14) / 3.4
                 = 1.4081

Plugging that back into the net magnitude formula we get the following for Resist Fire (base magnitude = 15%) and Regen Stamina (base magnitude = 10%)

net magnitude = 15% * 1 * 1.4081 * 2 * 1.25
              = 52.9%
net magnitude = 10% * 1 * 1.4081 * 2 * 1.25
              = 35.2%

Like the UESP page said, the skill multiplier formula was approximate, so I'd say this is close enough. The point is that potions affect your base Enchanting skill, which has a non-linear and weak relationship with enchantment strength. In fact, Enchanting at 100 only grants +25% to enchantment strength over Enchanting at 15 (rather than 100 / 15 = 6.7x), so taking 2 perks and Enchanting 20 is better than no perks and Enchanting 100.

* It actually looks something like this. The above formula doesn't seem to be totally precise, but the gist should be evident:

Effect of Potion of Fortify Enchanting on Enchantment Strength

Notes (as the comments show I should have been clearer here):
+46% = Necromage maximum (5 items of Fortify Alchemy)
+37% = Max with 5 items of Fortify Alchemy (Falmer Helmet + Circlet)
+32% = Max with 4 items of Fortify Alchemy
+25% = Enchanter's Elixir (best non-crafted item)

brymck
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  • This is the best possible answer, much more than I expected. Thanks for the formula walk-through, I tried using it but my skill multiplier was wrong since I didn't know how fortify enchanting potions worked, and I didn't know what values to use for (1 + Enchanter perk) and (1 + specific perk modifier). Also the graphs really help. – user19087 Jan 31 '12 at 18:23
  • Enchanter's Elixir (+25%) with Necromage as a vampire (+25%) creates potions that give a (+31%) boost to enchanting skill. Like I said, this gives me a +17% boost to enchantments, which is close enough to 32% and corroborated by your graph. – user19087 Jan 31 '12 at 18:25
  • @user19087 Do not forget to mark this question as the answer then :) – James Jan 31 '12 at 18:30
  • I did a bit of digging, it appears +32% is the maximum value of the alchemy/enchantment loop using four items, and +37% is the maximum of that loop using the extra headgear glitch (falmer helmet + etc). So thanks for using a graph with those values. What people don't seem to realize is that with Necromage, the strongest possible fortify enchanting potion is actually 46%, which results a 25% boost to enchantment strength. – user19087 Jan 31 '12 at 18:38
  • Which is actually just amazingly powerful. Anyway I'm sticking with plain old +25% fortify enchanting skill Enchanter's Elixir, anything else in my opinion is – user19087 Jan 31 '12 at 18:41
  • ... game-defeating, boring, and a waste of alchemy perks (I keep forgetting that the enter keys posts the comment) – user19087 Jan 31 '12 at 18:43
  • While not exactly pertinent, I'm trying to enchant a complete set of light glass armor to replace and outperform my magical non-armor attire which currently provides: (+60% fire resistance), (+250% magicka regen), (-75% spell reduction), (+80 Magicka) etc. Mainly because, as a long-distance mage, getting killed at full health by a single arrow occurs often enough to be incredibly annoying. On the flip side, a vampire mage in broad daylight with unenchanted armor is practically useless, limited to only 5 or so spells before the magicka runs dry. – user19087 Jan 31 '12 at 18:53
  • This answer shows that I'll never be able to match the enchanted strength of in-game items using in-game Enchanting Potions. – user19087 Jan 31 '12 at 18:53
  • @user19087 You're right about Necromage; I just wasn't sure how much it would add to the potion. I'll maybe revisit this answer, though, once the exact formula is known. I will say that since you're trying for a mage, these marginal bonuses are less relevant as you can reach -25% magicka cost per item and hit the armor cap easily. Those bonuses are game-breaking for builds like the stealth archer, though. – brymck Feb 01 '12 at 02:44
  • Necromage is incredibly pervasive, it affects the resulting strength of nearly every game aspect, often multiple times. For example, it will strengthen enchantments used to make potions, then strengthen the potion when imbibed. It is always applied last, that is the net magnitude will always be multiplied by 1.25. The only affects unchanged by necromage, as far as I know, are perks such as Magic Resistance, and those granted by the Standing Stones and Sailor's Repose. In addition to, of course, the actual vampiric powers themselves. – user19087 Feb 01 '12 at 05:01
  • why do you put 1.25 when counting skill multiplier? Shouldn't you put 100/100=1 – user4951 Dec 24 '16 at 03:07