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My boss is visiting his remote team members locally where I work in the United States. In an open environment by our cubes, he asked does anyone want to go out after work for dinner and drinks.

One of my team members has undergone AA counseling in the past and was present when this question was asked. My boss does not know his medical history of problematic drinking.

If I answer Yes to my boss, this may create a peer pressure effect on my team member for which alcohol could endanger his health / welfare due to a relapse. If I answer no , I miss out on a social opportunity to get to know my manager in a social context outside of office environment.

My goals:

  1. To avoid putting peer pressure on my other team member as I am his manager.

  2. To not put my team member in an unsafe / unhealthy environment at a bar where most likely I and my manager will be drinking.

  3. To be able to enjoy social time with my manager.

Edit: I feel this question differs from the suggested duplicate even though I was OP in that question too as this question was asked off the cuff and hence I was caught off guard by my team member being present. The other question was me considering my options rather than a question from my boss. Hence, I want to dodge answering right then and there until I can see my boss 1:1.

Is there a way I can skip answering this uncomfortable question until a more opportune time?

Anthony
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    Let them answer first? – Joe W Oct 09 '23 at 21:05
  • The presence of my other team member is what makes the timing awkward. If asked out of earshot, I would answer truthfully and be fine with it. – Anthony Oct 09 '23 at 21:07
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    It's also legitimate to say "dinner sounds great but I'm never comfortable with the social drinking thing; could some of us skip that part of the evening?" – keshlam Oct 09 '23 at 23:23
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    It is only uncomfortable because you are making it so. Has your team member expressed what kind of support he/she would like to get from you? (and if not, why not). – Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen Oct 10 '23 at 08:24
  • Strongly related: https://workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/185600/is-it-appropriate-to-speak-up-for-a-team-member-who-cant-drink-due-to-addiction/185621 – jcaron Oct 10 '23 at 16:12
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    As a note, I'm sure all bars serve non alcoholic drinks. There is a good possibility that if your friend ordered diet coke no one would even say a word about it. – Justin Oct 10 '23 at 18:45
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    Does this answer your question? Is it appropriate to speak up for a team member who can't drink due to addiction recovery when a company event is being planned? – keshlam Oct 10 '23 at 23:57
  • The duplicate pointed out by keshlam, which you asked as well, raises the question why the answer you got there is no longer sufficient or applicable. – Mark Rotteveel Oct 11 '23 at 11:35
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    There is nothing in that invitation that specifies that it's alcohol-only drinks. I've been to such events a lot of times and haven't had any alcohol quite often because I usually drive to the office, and if not, I still have things to do after work where I can't show up drunk. Realistically no one gives a hoot if you drink beer or cola, we are not in college anymore. – Davor Oct 12 '23 at 08:48
  • The answer remains the same, I think. Unless your co-worker has asked for help, answer for yourself and let them answer for themselves; you aren't committing them to anything. You might point out that some folks are uncomfortable with the bar scene, if that's what they have in mind, and suggest drinks at the restaurant instead.. but that is actually likely to be what they have in mind, since they're not looking to make a party evening out of it, just an hour or three of getting to know each other a bit better. – keshlam Oct 12 '23 at 12:24
  • Your coworker has obviously shared this information with you. Have you privately asked your coworker how he feels about this invitation at this point in his recovery? Learning to deal with these situations is part of the recovery process, and he'll need to be able to do so on his own at some point. If he's not ready for that yet, offer to help out, if he is ready, then let him handle it and your job is to give him confidence and back him up if there's any push back. Backup should be your job with any of your coworkers should there ever be peer pressure to drink. – FreeMan Oct 12 '23 at 12:29
  • 'm trying to understand this from a non-U.S. perspective. In my view, Americans seem to have distinct personal boundaries, refraining from asking personal questions about things like pregnancy or religion. However, I've noticed that on platforms like this Stack Exchange, questions about attending parties often come up. I'm from India, I can simply say, 'No, I don't drink,' and no one seems to mind. But here, it appears that the only strong reasons not to drink are having strong religious beliefs or being in recovery from AA. Why does there seem to be peer pressure to drink in American society? – RajaRaviVarma Oct 12 '23 at 12:49
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    @RajaRaviVarma Re "Why does there seem to be peer pressure to drink in American society?" I don't drink alcohol (for personal rather than religious or medical reasons). I have never experienced such peer pressure in an after-work activity. Stating "No, I don't drink" has always been sufficient for me over more than three decades of living in the US. On occasion it made me an obvious choice for designated driver which I don't mind. Now, clearly this is anecdotal experience, and the US is a big country with diverse work environments, so YMMV. – njuffa Oct 12 '23 at 22:39
  • @njuffa YMMV indeed. As an American living in the US, I've had exactly the opposite experience. – notmySOaccount Oct 13 '23 at 00:59

6 Answers6

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Is there a way I can skip answering this uncomfortable question until a more opportune time?

I don't think it's necessary to do that - supporting your team member doesn't mean you need to infantilize them or treat them as if they are made of glass. I can virtually guaranteee that your team member has frequent moments in their day-to-day life where they recieve casual invites to social situations where alcohol is a factor, and they will have coping mechanisms and strategies to handle this. If they didn't they wouldn't be suceeding in their recovery (which they presumably are).

Revealing the team member's condition to your boss without their explicit consent is a non-starter, don't even think of going there. It's not your place, and it would stand a good chance of doing irreprable harm to your working relationship with them, and potentially even harm your relationship with your manager. Someone who goes around revealing private medical information about their colleagues where it is not necessary is not someone who should be in a position of responsibility!

So how can you support your team member? Because while you didn't spell that out as an explicit goal that's what:

To avoid putting peer pressure on my other team member as I am his manager.

To not put my team member in an unsafe / unhealthy environment at a bar where most likely I and my manager will be drinking.

Really translate into. Assuming when you respond "yes" to the manager's invite that the team member also says "yes" then you can take them aside at the next convenient time and check that they are really okay with it, and let them know that you're mindful that it might be a difficult situation for them and that if they wanted to duck out after the food portion that you're not going to take any issue with that and will support any pretext they wished to use. If they were comfortable staying the entire time and simply consuming non-alcoholic beverages then you support that - they're not a child and it's not on you to decide what their comfort levels should be.

motosubatsu
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    In short: Behave as if you know nothing about that member. – iBug Oct 10 '23 at 19:16
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    If you as local guide have any option tto choose the location, you can ask the team member for ideas, so they have possibility to chose a comfortable environment. Not each bar triggers equal. Personal trigger can be very different. – Allerleirauh Oct 10 '23 at 20:23
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    If you take that team member aside later, you may also ask if they'd like you to suggest to your boss that said team member act as the designated driver, "in case someone else over-indulges" - or simply relay that they've volunteered. They'd "take one for the team" and have a perfect "excuse" to not drink with, IME, a minimum of pressure or assumptions. – minnmass Oct 10 '23 at 20:47
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    @minnmass: That works once. But if the workplace frequently has these outings, then the team member will need a better excuse (or, at the very least, they will need to be willing to say "I don't drink" in front of everyone). – Kevin Oct 11 '23 at 00:40
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    @minnmass: The team member can just say they don't drink alcohol. I don't. I can drink alcohol -- I've had the occasional limoncello at the end of the meal when living close to Nice -- but I don't enjoy it. People look at you funny at the beginning, but they get used to you ordering sodas or juices. And if they insist, a firm "No" -- no explanation, just "No" -- usually ends that line of conversation. During team outings especially, I was rarely the only one not drinking alcohol, so it was way less of a problem than with "friends of friends". – Matthieu M. Oct 11 '23 at 09:08
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    @minnmass I wouldn't suggest that. Being the designated driver is a significant responsiblity, and you don't want them to feel pressured to do it. – AmiralPatate Oct 11 '23 at 09:14
  • @Kevin, for the first time, the "designated driver" dodge is genuinely brilliant and my hat is off to you. To cover subsequent events PROACTIVELY, this is genuinely an incident where HR IS your friend. Go have a VERY quiet chat with your HR guy, explain the situation, and let THEM take the manager aside for a very quiet "Hey, this is something you should know" chat, if they think it is something that needs to be communicated. And note: how this plays out down the road may tell you some very useful things about whether you want to continue working there. – John R. Strohm Oct 11 '23 at 11:39
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    @Kevin No one should need an "excuse" to abstain from recreational drugs. – Basil Bourque Oct 11 '23 at 23:49
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    @JohnR.Strohm it's not OP's place to share that information, no matter how quietly. – Chris H Oct 12 '23 at 07:10
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    I'm with you, @MatthieuM. I have a number of coworkers who frequently discuss their post-work drinking activities. I simply tell them I decided many years ago to quit drinking. Usually, the response is "I wish I could do that", or "oh, that's cool". The response has never been a college-level, "come on, you wimp, chug one down!". – FreeMan Oct 12 '23 at 12:24
  • The designated driver thing is really crumby because coworker should NOT have to drive drunk people home to avoid drinking. – le3th4x0rbot Oct 13 '23 at 10:12
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  1. I understand your concern for your colleague. Their sobriety is their responsibility and their private business, not yours, so make sure that you don't answer for them or otherwise disclose their personal information/situation to anyone. Respect and honor their right to privacy.

  2. Having said that, you could simply accept the invitation and be an example to your colleague by not partaking in any alcohol during the outing.

joeqwerty
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    Yes. Go there and drink virgin cocktails - the plus side is: they are very delicious and you can drink more of them – til_b Oct 12 '23 at 08:05
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Is there a way I can skip answering this uncomfortable question until a more opportune time?

You answer for yourself, and let your team mate member for himself.

Presumably, your team member is an adult and capable of handling his issues on his own.

And whatever you choose to do, it is not your role to disclose your team member's issues to your boss.

Joe Strazzere
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  • If the team member had been able to handle this on their own, they wouln't have joined any AA meetings. You can't assume this. Placing responsibility where it belongs is one thing; using that as an excuse not to offer any help is another. – reinierpost Oct 11 '23 at 19:54
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    @reinierpost (A) Help should be rendered after being requested, not preemptively (except in extreme/urgent cases). No such request has been mentioned in the Question. (B) Joining AA meetings is someone handling this on their own. – Basil Bourque Oct 11 '23 at 23:37
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  1. "Hey, just let me check something on that and I'll get back to you in 5 mins"
  2. Walk back to your desk. If necessary, pretend to look at your calendar/phone for 5 mins.
  3. Message your boss and say "yeah, I'm in".
Philip Kendall
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  • You might need to explain the reason for pretending to be unsure for 5 minutes. – bdsl Oct 11 '23 at 10:33
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    "just needed to check if i had going on but it's next week, all clear" – bracco23 Oct 11 '23 at 10:42
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    @bdsl "Thought I might have had something else on" – Philip Kendall Oct 11 '23 at 10:42
  • @PhilipKendall I mean you should explain it to us, not to the boss. – bdsl Oct 11 '23 at 11:03
  • @bdsl "Hey, just let me check something on that, and I'll get back to you in 5 mins", if you don't wait the 5 minutes, they think you're just pretending you're busy to impress them, or if you can come up with any excuse. – Or4ng3h4t Oct 11 '23 at 14:05
  • @Or4ng3h4t yes but why not just say yes straight away if you you know that that's what you're going to say? – bdsl Oct 11 '23 at 19:18
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    @bdsl Because the question the OP has asked is "Is there a way I can skip answering this uncomfortable question until a more opportune time?". This is that. – Philip Kendall Oct 11 '23 at 19:33
  • Thanks @PhilipKendall, now I understand, the point is to avoid saying yes within the hearing of the co-worker. Sorry I hadn't kept in mind that the original question was asked out loud in their presence. – bdsl Oct 11 '23 at 21:01
  • @bdsl, exactly. The awkwardness arose because by saying yes within earshot of my team member, I can create unintended peer pressure as his manager – Anthony Oct 16 '23 at 00:51
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First of all, thanks for being concerned for your reportee - of many other things, this is also what a manager should be doing.

I'd suggest, accept the invite, find out a restaurant / diner where they do not serve alcohol, and mention to your boss that

"I know of a good place, which will be appreciated by all the members for the team dinner. May I suggest we plan the dinner at <insert place here>?"

You'll not miss the social gathering, while keeping your team member safe.

Just to be on the safe side, (or in case, your boss is keen on the "drinking" part) mention to your boss (privately, before the arrangement is done) that not all the members might be comfortable with social drinking, so this place you've suggested does not serve alcohol - no more info than that. They should be able to get the hint.

Sourav Ghosh
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  • At least here in german speaking europe, I have not heard of restaurants that do not serve alcohol. So this is not a universal option. – kirbby Oct 10 '23 at 07:40
  • @kirbby I thought the question was tagged [tag:united-states]? – Sourav Ghosh Oct 10 '23 at 09:24
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    Yes you are right, I just wanted to emphasize that it is not possible everywhere :) – kirbby Oct 10 '23 at 10:32
  • Even in the United States, a restaurant which would be appropriate for this type of event and does not serve alcohol would seem quite the oddity, wouldn't it? Other than in dry counties, of course... – jcaron Oct 10 '23 at 16:15
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    If the boss suggested drinks and dinner, this doesnt seem like a great plan. At very least you probably want to let the boss know in advance that it's an alcohol free place. – JMac Oct 10 '23 at 17:54
  • @JMac That is what is mentioned in the last sentence, but I'll make it more explicit. Thanks. – Sourav Ghosh Oct 11 '23 at 04:41
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The last time I supervised anybody (about two decades ago), I made the following two things very clear:

  1. Participation in after-hours socialization was entirely at the subordinate's discretion, and
  2. Any superior who came to me about a non-participating subordinate would be told that this is my policy for my people.
EvilSnack
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