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I've bought a non-TTL Yongnuo flash (YN-560 IV) for my Canon 77D and it works fine when shooting through the viewfinder. However switching to Liveview mode, I found out that it annoyingly stops working. It is possible to get the flash to fire if I switch to high-speed burst mode, however in that case the flash fails to synchronize with the camera properly. Is there a way to force the camera to sync the manual flash properly?

I've read the answers to this related question, however my camera doesn't have a silent shooting mode, so they don't apply. Likewise the Canon manual says:

A non-Canon flash will not fire during Live View shooting.

However it obviously does if I switch to high-speed mode and the manual doesn't say anything about how to enable proper synchronization.

inkista
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JonathanReez
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6 Answers6

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With my ti2 non-Canon flash fires like it should when shooting through view finder but in live view it fires only if you use continuess shooting and then it fires on second exposure, not on first shot. So with live view you’ll have to Take two shots to have the flash exposure.

Toni

Toni
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I tried this today with my canon700d and faced the same problem, I bought a set of neweer wirless trigers and a speedlite chinese flash and when connevting the flash direct it failed in the live view mode ... BUT.. when I connected the transmitter via a pc synch cable to the remote pc socket it worked perfectly in the live view mode

Bassam Ismail
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I called Cannon and muscled information out of them I found a workaround for this issue.

I have a Canon rebel t7i. I do macro photography and I like to zoom in with the live view and use an external flash I didn't know what to do because it's a non Canon flash and of course it won't work with live view here's the work around I found.

if your flash has a transceiver built into it or attached to it then set it to a channel then go into your settings for your on camera flash and make it so it will trigger an off camera flash on that channel.

Pop your flash up on your camera cover the flash so no light comes out BAM now you have live view and disabled exposure simulation with a non Canon flash. exposure simulation might still be working and just account for the flash I'm not really sure but all I care about is being able to see what I'm shooting without a bunch of light flooding the subject prior to flash.

Aaron
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It is fairly obvious, both from the statements in the Instruction Manuals of practically every EOS DSLR ever made with Live View capability but without 'Live View Silent shooting' modes and from the actual user experience when one tries to use a manual flash that can't communicate its presence to the camera body, that Canon does not support using a flash which the camera cannot even detect is attached to the hot shoe in Live View mode with the non-LV Silent Shooting models. The reason none of the Manuals for the non-LV Silent Shooting models say anything about how to enable proper synchronization is because these cameras, as designed, are not capable of such synchronization with a third party manual-only flash.

What problem are you trying to solve that requires you to use a non-Canon manual only flash in Live View with your 77D?

Michael C
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  • My problem is shooting using the WiFi, which allows you to use the Live View mode. I guess I'd just have to upgrade the flash eventually – JonathanReez Dec 28 '17 at 08:22
  • YN685 is both TTL and can receive YN622 or YN560/RF603 signals. Of course you'd need a YN622 or similar transmitter with the four extra contacts on the hot shoe.

    If you're only wanting to mount the flash directly on the camera's hot shoe, any flash with the four extra pins will work, even when used in manual power mode. There has to be communication between the flash and camera body.

     – Michael C Dec 28 '17 at 21:49
  • Turns out that higher end models do support this, e.g. the Canon Mark IV fires the same flash without issues in Live View mode. So it seems to be an artificial limitation in the software of cheaper cameras. – JonathanReez Dec 29 '17 at 23:59
  • @JonathanReez Yes, all of the models with "Live View Silent Shooting Modes" behave the same as the 5DIV. That's why the answer uses the qualification, "... every EOS DSLR ever made with Live View capability but without 'Silent shooting' capability in Live View..." – Michael C Dec 30 '17 at 14:11
  • I've edited the answer to try and make it clearer that I was specifically talking about only the models that do not have 'LV Silent Shooting' modes. – Michael C Dec 30 '17 at 14:18
  • Ok, now it's clear. So am I correct in assuming this is purely an artificial software limitation by Canon? – JonathanReez Dec 30 '17 at 14:21
  • Not necessarily. Different models have different shutter assemblies. Those with 1/4000 minimum Tv and slower X-sync speeds (1/160-200 for FF, 1/200 for APS-C) have slower shutter curtains with longer sensor transit times. The models with LV SS modes tend to have 1/8000 minimum Tv and faster X-sync (1/250 for FF and APS-C. The curtains travel 24mm for FF but only 15.5mm for APS-C) This may affect the ability to sync when the camera can not communicate with the flash. – Michael C Dec 30 '17 at 16:13
  • But then how does the sync work in viewfinder mode? It's basically the same as Liveview mode, except that the mirror pops up before shot is taken. So they could have easily implemented it in any camera by introducing a slight delay before the Liveview shutter fires when an external flash is on. – JonathanReez Dec 30 '17 at 16:27
  • It's not basically the same, though. In LV mode the shutter curtain has to close, the sensor has to be cleared, then the shutter curtains cycle just as if one were in viewfinder mode, the sensor is read out, and then the second curtain reopens without resetting the first curtain. That's a lot more movement of the shutter curtains between the time the shutter is fired and the image is taken. – Michael C Dec 30 '17 at 16:40
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    Correct, but once the first curtain closes it's basically exactly the same as with viewfinder shooting. So at this point introducing a small delay before the first curtain re-opens would've been sufficient. When firing with flash you usually don't need fast bursts anyway as the flash takes a while to recharge. Which is basically what happens when I shoot in high-speed mode on my 77D - the flash does fire, but a tiny fraction of a second later than necessary. So I'd say it's an example of sandbagging by Canon, forcing novice users to buy official flashes. – JonathanReez Dec 30 '17 at 16:43
  • You don't need an "official" flash. Any E-TTL capable Godox, Yongnuo, Shanny, Nissin, etc. will give you the same capability. – Michael C Dec 30 '17 at 16:49
  • Canon's business models have not recently changed. Their products reflect a higher priority on everything working consistently and as expected every time than perhaps other makers do. Thus they are slower to bring many features to the market (in any level model). They tend to spend more time in the testing phase of product development than others do. They have also been making sure their higher models offer features and performance that their lower models lack for decades. This is nothing new. – Michael C Dec 30 '17 at 16:51
  • Their design and marketing decisions also seem to place a priority on the user experience in terms of only promising what they can actually deliver for a specific product. With slower shutters (which are less expensive to make and don't take the same beating faster shutters do so they can be made less robust and still give good reliability) they can offer lower priced products than if they put their premium shutter in every camera they make. The additional shutter lag when using LV with one of these slower shutters might have been deemed unacceptable to those guiding Canon's designers. – Michael C Dec 30 '17 at 16:57
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You should install YN 622 in the hot shoe, and a manual flash on it. And even better use a wireless transmitter(installed on YN 622) for your 560, for example, RF-603 or YN560-tx

user99999
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The answer above isn't really an answer at all.. Disable silent LV shooting in the menu. There is "silent lv" 1 and 2. Just disable it and it will work

The Suburban Hippie
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