Belaying two seconds?

Question

I'm planning on doing some Grade III scrambling/low grade multi-pitch climbing this weekend. Normally just me and my girlfriend would do this kind of thing, I'll lead she'd second. But I'm thinking of taking another friend along this time. I'll still do all the leading with two seconds.

I'm unclear on techniques to belay two seconds from above though?

Answer 1

Double Rope

You need two ropes (of obviously different colours so as not to confuse them). Tie into both ropes, one on each side of your belay loop, your seconds will each tie into the other end of one of the ropes. When you set up your belay after you've led the climb, put both ropes into your belay device, you can belay for both of your seconds at once.

Belaying two seconds at the same time is easy if they pace each other (let the slower climber go first, so the faster one can easily keep pace), or you can belay them up one at a time. If you're really good, you can belay one of your seconds as they lead the next pitch while simultaneously belaying up your other second.

^{Top belaying with two ropes using a Petzl reverso}

This of course takes serious rope management skills, so for your first try it will be easiest to belay one up at a time.

Answer 2

While belaying two seconds at once using the method ShemSeger pointed out is my favorite, it does take a fair amount of experience so I would not recommend it to someone climbing for the first time with two seconds.

If you're just starting out, I recommend you use the Caterpillar technique: You lead on a single rope and belay the second as you would normally, except the second climber trails another rope behind them and clips it into each piece of gear. When the second reaches the belay, pull up the rest of the slack on the third climber's rope and put them on belay (just as you did for the second). The third climber climbs and removes the gear you placed.

At the belay, the second climber can help with rope management: flaking ropes so they're ready for you to lead off the next pitch, and making sure the ropes don't tangle.

It does have several disadvantages (mostly... it's slow), but it's extremely safe. Most importantly, it's also closest to what you are already used to doing. It's my recommendation for any first-timer party of three: you've already got enough new things going on.

Answer 3

I assume you are only looking for options by going from belay to belay (as opposed to continuous securing like going on taught rope).

Method using half-ropes:

You tie in on both ropes, your partners on a single one each. They belay you normally on both ropes until you set up the belay-station. Then you secure them using a Munter hitch or a tuber like system to belay them. Using a tuber is preferable, as it autoblocks and does not twist the ropes around each other. They can climb simultaneously, just having to keep a minimal distance, which depends a lot on how fast the rope is pulled in by the belayer.

Advantages:

• Both partners can go at their one pace (as long as the faster one starts first).
• One falling does not affect the other.

Disadvantages:

• Two half ropes are heavier than one single rope.
• The belayer has two ropes to manage

Method using one single rope

You obviously tie in on one end, the partner which climbs best on the other end. The weaker partner ties in at a save distance from the end. The exact distance is always a compromise between available rope length and safety margin between climbers. The one in the middle can be tied in using a variety of knots, I prefer an overhand secured by a double fisherman's knot. The weaker one starts climbing and the second one follows as soon as the rope in between them is almost taught. If the first falls, this does not affect the second. But if the second falls, he will pull the first off the rock.

Advantages:

• Only one rope needed which is lighter than half ropes.

Disadvantages:

• The second has to climb exactly at the pace of the first.
• The second has to be fairly competent as a fall will pull off the first.
• The usable rope length per pitch is reduced by the distance between the partners

Method using two single ropes

You tie in on one end of the first rope, one partner ties in on this and the second rope. The other ties in on the other end of the second rope. After you led the pitch the first partner climbs it and clips the second rope into the protection. If the pitch goes sideways and he is insecure, the second partner which is still down at the previous belay can belay him from behind. Thus falls with swings can be caught. After the first partner reached your belay, the second one climbs the pitch.

Advantages:

• Very easy to handle.
• Perfectly save, especially in traverses for the first partner.
• full rope length available for pitches.

Disadvantages:

• very slow (nearly twice as long as with half ropes)
• heaviest setup as you carry two full ropes

I would always prefer the half-rope method, its the fastest and save. And the additional weight should not be an issue, after all you are three climbers. If you really do not want to handle two ropes (though it is very easy, just try it out) I would recommend the method using one single rope. The last method is really just in case you need the rope length, and both your partners struggle with the grade you are using or you are insecure handling two ropes (again, thats a none-issue). And keep in mind: You are always a lot slower in a three person rope team than with two.

Answer 4

Its pretty easy for the 2 seconds being together or always nearby, and a bit stretchy for the one leading the climb (You). When I did one similar not-so-tough scramble, I used a trick that at least worked for me.

1. I was climbing on a single rope, tied at the center & the two idiots with me were on a single strand each. I used a 8mm'er rope, light and good enough. Since it was easier and the two seconds were climbing with very much the same pace and loading the rope at the same time.

2. Should you choose to go on a Linked end approach where obviously you are tied up at an end and at the other end you have your best second and you have the second second tied at the middle. With you on lead, your girlfriend should set after the other second gets a good 20-25 feet up, since you don't want your second second being a bit more experienced (I assumed) getting frustrated having to climb slower than what she would prefer but then the faster one must gauge where they are with respect to each others position, ensuring that while on the move, little time is consumed between moves either below or above the other second. The issue with this system is that, you will lack time-efficiency since you belay one second at a time (comparatively easier for you) and, maximum pitches you can go up are half the length of rope.

3. If you go for Double link, with you at one end, the two seconds tied at the other end 10-15 feet apart, you could gain more on efficiency, but then both of them will be loading the rope at the same time. Here as well you should have stronger climber tied below and the weaker one 10-15 ft above her. If your last climber falls, it is likely that she will pull off the climber above her. So, it is advisable to have the weaker climber on the team tied-in above the stronger climber on the end.

4. For tieing the middle second, an overhand on a bight with about 10-12 inches of slack tail should do enough.

5. If you at all find it necessary, you can go for something like a Petzyl reverso. Understanding how a Reverso works, I just now pull out a book (thanks to your question, I could at least take it off from my store room after months!)
   Mountaineering Methodology Part - III by Thomas Kublak

Self-braking is caused by the fact that the second who is loading the rope causes the upper strand leading to the belay device to press against the lower strand, thereby pinching it. The sitting second essentially breaks the rope herself. The belayer at the stance therefore does not need to contunually hold the inactive part of the rope in her hand, it is enough that she takes it in during the phases when the second is advancing upward.

Nonetheless, have a great time out there buddy!

Answer 5

Leading with two ropes and simultaneously belaying up both followers (a la ShemSeger's answer) is the gold standard for a party of three in technical terrain.

I want to discuss another technique that is much simpler, but is also very situation dependent. It is best suited for the type of terrain in the question: class III/IV scrambling (perhaps very easy class V climbing with competent followers) that doesn't wander too severely. I would absolutely not use this technique in any terrain that the followers might be reasonably expected to fall in or need tension pull a move.

The basic idea is to simply climb with one rope that both followers are tied onto: one at the end as normal and the other tied in perhaps 3--5m up the rope with a 1--2m leash/pigtail. After leading a pitch, the leader belays up both followers as they climb up at the same pace but vertically staggered. The key to making this work smoothly and safely is that the followers need to communicate and coordinate their movements so as to prevent too much slack from developing. If you have it as a reference point, this is very similar to moving as a party of three on a glacier, except that the middle person is connected 3--5m from one end.

Implementation Details & Tips:

• Tying the middle climber in is the crux of this approach. A common method is to tie an alpine butterfly at an appropriate point with a 1--2m loop. This loop is then fed through the climber's harness tie-in points, passed over their head and shoulders and then under their feet, creating a girth hitch through the tie-in points. This girth hitch can also be done before the climber puts their harness on. Alternatively, connect the harness to the loop with two locking carabiners. A third approach would be to use a 120cm sling / PAS / Purcell Prussik from the climber's harness clipped (with two lockers!) to an alpine butterfly with a typical loop.

• The distance between the end climber and the butterfly and the length of the midway climber's pigtail need careful consideration. The suggestions of 3--5m and 1--2m, respectively, are generally a good starting point for typical uses.

  • If the followers are too close together, they risk knocking into each other should one of them fall (account for rope stretch!). If they are too far apart, it makes coordination difficult.
  • If the pigtail is too short, it will be difficult for the followers to climb without tugging on each other or pulling the other off should one fall. If it is too long, there will be more tangles and it will be difficult to clean or reclip gear before the knot gets jammed against it.

• When departing an anchor, the midway climber simply unclips from the anchor and begins climbing for several meters until the slack is taken up for the end climber. The midway climber then needs to pause for several moments while the end climber breaks down the anchor and they can begin climbing simultaneously.

• Once the midway climber reaches the anchor and secures themselves, tie a Munter hitch to finish bringing up the end climber. Ideally, there would be a large ledge.

• Both followers need to be cognizant of staying vertically aligned with the anchor or next piece of protection on the pitch. Pendulum falls can be catastrophic.

  • Some amount of traversing on a pitch can be accommodated by increasing the rope length between the two followers and having the midway climber reclip protection pieces, creating a running belay between the two followers. This can quickly become quite dubious.

• It generally works best to have one follower (generally the weaker one) manage the pace and have their connection to the belayer tight; the other follower matches this pace, striving to keep a small amount of slack in their tie-in.

Pros & Cons

As compared to each follower on a separate rope, we have the following pros and cons:

Pros

• One rope. This means that only one rope needs to be carried on the approach, coiled/uncoiled, and managed at the belay.
• If the terrain is suitable, this technique is very amenable to quick and efficient hip belays and terrain belays. This saves the time and material of needing to build formal anchors with a masterpoint before rigging up a plaquette/guide plate/reverso/ATC guide and then pulling the length of two ropes through it.
  • In easy terrain, the speed of the followers is often limited by how quickly the leader can belay in the slack. It is vastly quicker for the belayer to haul in slack on a single rope (especially with a hip belay, if applicable) than it is to manage taking in slack on two independent ropes.
• Quick and efficient. In the mountains, speed is safety.

Cons

• Only one rope available for rappels.
• Less security for the followers. It prevents catastrophic falls, but doesn't provide the same "snug toprope" situation of two independent ropes. Potential for unexpected fall dynamics and the followers pulling each other off.
• Dangerous fall potential on traversing terrain; can be partially mitigated with running belay techniques.
• Followers need to coordinate movements and be comfortable climbing with small amounts of slack. Need enough rope systems knowledge to understand the safety system. In general, this technique puts an onus on the followers to ensure each other's safety.
• The length of rope available to lead pitches is shortened by 5+m, i.e., you are limited to 50--55m leads with a 60m rope. This is rarely problematic in the easy terrain for which this technique is suited (in fact, one might often choose to further shorten the rope by tying Kiwi coils in such terrain).