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I tried pitting the sentinels vs scourge without any heroes. Just let the creeps battle on their own. I did this 5 times and on those 5 matches, the scourge always wins the match.

Does this gives the scourge slight advantage in matches? Also what is the factor that makes the scourge wins on those matches?

1 Answers1

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This might have something to do with the static differences with the map layout. They may be small differences but definitely adds up as the match progresses on between the two creeps.

From this article.

Mid lane in Particular

Mid lane, as opposed to top and bot, has a slight difference in creep arrival, as a result of pre-discussed enlargement of scourge base. This means that the sentinel ranged creep is standing up-hill, and a ranged hero will be able to actively use the Fog of War, thus having a huge advantage in the first minute of the lane as the enemy do not have the ability to predict when the attacks are landing.

Ghouls and Treants

Although these two units are alike in almost every case, there is one small difference; Treants have a greater base than the ghouls, due to the greater unit size they have. This in combination with the Treants coming from the lower left corner results in Ghouls being able to 'hide' behind the Treants, making them a lot harder to hit.

The positioning of the towers and also the slightly larger base of the scourge base might also affect the way the scourge's creeps arrival as they spawn on their base.

  • He said without heroes, thus this answer is not related to the question. – Fadeway Jul 21 '12 at 08:47
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    I only mentioned about the map differences that might affect the creeps arrival and positioning. I didn't MENTION any about the heroes. So why downvote? Did you even read my answer carefully? –  Jul 21 '12 at 08:50
  • So it may have to do with the sentinel's treants being slightly larger than the ghouls. Making them easier to get hit by towers and creeps alike. The mid positioning also might be a BIG factor since on my simulation, it is the first one to go down, thus affecting the also the bottom racks after the scourge destroyed the mid towers and racks. –  Jul 21 '12 at 08:57
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    I'm also trying to run the game with no heroes and just simply watch them but it's kinda taking quite long and boring to just simply watch. Minimizing the game also pauses the match so I simply give up. How long does each match run anyway? –  Jul 21 '12 at 09:10
  • I read your answer thrice actually. The quotes are irrelevant (one mentions sentinel creeps being uphill, which works against the scourge, hence not explaining why they win, and both talk about player advantages, not creep ones). The rest is ambiguous talk about positioning: if the same question existed asking why the sentinels always win, this answer could be pasted without any edits, and wouldn't look any less out of place. Are you able to elaborate on why the Scourge has a positional advantage? – Fadeway Jul 21 '12 at 09:13
  • @patcol the quote is talking about players having an easier time to click the treants. AFAIK sprite size has nothing to do with hit chance, and creeps/towers obviously aren't clicking enemies. Hence, in a creep vs creep match, ghouls being smaller than treants should have no effect on survivability. – Fadeway Jul 21 '12 at 09:15
  • @Fadeway Does it mean that they also have the same hitbox size? I really find the treants easier to block than the ghouls. I always thought its because of their slightly bigger size than the ghouls that makes them easier to block. –  Jul 21 '12 at 09:19
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    You may be on to something here, I didn't consider surround speed. I haven't played much DotA though, so I'm not sure if treants are really easier to block - sounds like an obvious imbalance. Gonna take your word for it though. – Fadeway Jul 21 '12 at 09:21
  • @Fadeway Actually, having one of the creep on the sents do give the scourge the advantage later on on the mid lane. Try simulating one and you'll see. patcol might be right on this one. The sents most of the time on mid lane wins the first wave, but winning the first wave doesn't give them the advantage though. –  Jul 21 '12 at 09:23
  • @MegaNairda It usually takes an hour. Though on the 45min mark on the game clock, the winner is already obvious. Try running the game on Multiplayer mode instead on singleplayer. In that way, you can minimize the game on do other things without the game getting paused automatically. –  Jul 21 '12 at 09:31
  • @MegaNairda, You can simply run on "lan mode" so that it will continue running while minimized. – Pacerier Sep 29 '14 at 22:21