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Player A has a Wrecking Ogre (4/4 double strike) and decides to use the Bloodrush ability of Ghor-Clan Rampager, so now the Wrecking Ogre is a 7/7 with Double Strike + Trample.

If Player B decides to block it with 3 2/2 creatures, on the first combat, Wrecking Ogre's power will be down to 1/1,and that 1/1 will go to the player because it has trample.

My concern is about the second strike of wrecking ogre. Since there are no more blockers, will it deal 7/7 damage or 1/1 damage?

And if wrecking ogre is blocked by 2 5/5 creatures? Will it be dead before it can attack again? Will the Trample and Double Strike will be useless?

murgatroid99
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user6555
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  • http://boardgames.stackexchange.com/questions/5950/how-does-the-double-strike-mechanic-interact-with-other-mechanics-like-lifelink?rq=1 – Colin D Jan 07 '14 at 19:14
  • Given that you seem to have a bit of confusion about what power, toughness, and damage are, you may want to go back and read the basic rulebook (pdf), since there could be other basic things you've overlooked. – Cascabel Jan 07 '14 at 19:26
  • Voting to NOT close. I would not consider the answer to the linked question adequate for this question. – ikegami Jan 07 '14 at 19:37
  • @ikegami Yeah, the answer there isn't as good as it could be - could probably use another answer, with some examples. – Cascabel Jan 07 '14 at 19:41
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    Regardless of what the existing answer to the other question says, I think someone who reads and understands an adequate answer to that question would then be able to figure out this one, so I do think it's a duplicate. – David Z Jan 07 '14 at 21:47
  • @David Z, I don't see it. Where does it explain that dealing damage does not lower power? – ikegami Jan 08 '14 at 02:52
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    That's not what this question is about, though. It's an unrelated misconception that user6555 has. – David Z Jan 08 '14 at 02:54
  • Maybe you should read again. That's exactly his question. even if you're right, it's very important to address his unrelated misconception. The questions are far from identical. – ikegami Jan 08 '14 at 02:57

2 Answers2

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It's power and toughness never change. It's never 1/1 or 1/7 or 7/1. It's 7/7 throughout. It merely gains marked damage.

In the first Combat Damage Step, the Ogre assigns 7 damage. It will assign and deal 2 damage two each of the 2/2[1] (and kills them) and 1 to the player.

In the second Combat Damage Step, the Ogre assigns 7 damage. It will assign and deal 7 damage the player.

If the damage it did the second step was reduced by the damage it did in the first step, it would never deal any in the second as a creature always deals its power in damage.

and if wrecking ogre is blocked by 2 5/5 creature?

Only creatures with First Strike or Double Strike participate in the First Strike combat damage step.

Assuming these 5/5 have neither,

  • First strike combat damage step: Ogre deals 5 to one 5/5 (and kills it) and 2 to the other (which survives with 2 damage).

  • Normal strike combat damage step: Ogre deals 3 to the remaining 5/5 (and kills it) and 4 to the defender. The 5/5 deals 5 to the Ogre (which survives with 5 damage).

  1. It's possible to assign more, but there's rarely a reason to assign more than the minimum.
ikegami
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  • Initially overlooked your second question. Added answer. – ikegami Jan 07 '14 at 17:51
  • Your opening clarification is good, but might not go far enough: the question says "...power will be down to 1/1...", suggesting that the OP may be thinking of toughness as part of power. – Cascabel Jan 07 '14 at 19:28
  • I assumed he just spoke loosely and that he know the number of on the left of the / is its power and the number of the right of the / is its toughness. If he didn't, he knows now. – ikegami Jan 07 '14 at 19:35
  • It's been a while but unless the blockers have banding can't you just assign all the damage to one creature which would cause more trample damage to the player? So in this case instead of doing 1 + 7 damage you could do 5 + 5 damage and only kill 2 creatures instead of 3? – Joe W Jan 07 '14 at 20:56
  • @JoeW Nope. CR702.19b The controller of an attacking creature with trample first assigns damage to the creature(s) blocking it. Once all those blocking creatures are assigned lethal damage, any remaining damage is assigned as its controller chooses among those blocking creatures and the player or planeswalker the creature is attacking. […edit out for brevity ignore effects that change amount of damage…] The attacking creature's controller need not assign lethal damage to all those blocking creatures but in that case can't assign any damage to the player or planeswalker it's attacking. – ghoppe Jan 07 '14 at 21:13
  • @ghoppe Thanks for the clarification, that makes a lot of sense – Joe W Jan 07 '14 at 21:25
  • @JoeW The advantage banding gives when blocking is that the defender can divide the damage as he or she chooses, and assign all the damage to one creature and none to himself. As per CR702.19b, Trample damage doesn't have to be assigned to a player, so banding on defenders, in practice, usually nullifies Trample. – ghoppe Jan 07 '14 at 21:27
  • To clarify, by "usually" I mean if the defender chooses. There may be a situation where the defender wants to take some Trample damage. ;) – ghoppe Jan 07 '14 at 21:30
  • I think it is important to note, because it was a point of confusion when I first started playing, that if the Ogre did not have Trample he would not assign ANY damage to the player in the second combat phase. Even if he killed all the blockers in the first he is still considered blocked. – AdamP Jan 07 '14 at 22:14
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When a creature in combat has first strike or double strike, there are two combat damage phases. In the first phase, only creatures with first strike and double strike deal damage, and in the second, only creatures without first strike deal damage.

When a creature in combat has trample, all damage past what is necessary to deal lethal damage to all blockers is dealt directly to the defending player.

What this means specifically for your question is:

In the first example, a 7/7 ogre with double strike and trample is blocked by 3 2/2 creatures. In the first combat damage phase, the ogre distributes 2 damage to each blocker and 1 damage to the defending player. Then, in the second combat damage phase, there are no surviving blockers, so the ogre deals all 7 damage to the defending player.

In the second example, the same ogre is blocked by 2 5/5 creatures. In the first combat damage phase, the ogre distributes 5 damage to one of its blockers and 2 to the other, destroying the first one. Then in the second combat damage phase, the ogre distributes 3 damage to the remaining blocker and 4 damage to the defending player, killing the other blocker. The blocker also deals 5 damage to the ogre, which is not enough to destroy it.

murgatroid99
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  • what if one or two of the 5/5 creature has first strike on it,will it kill the ogre before it deal damage to creatures/player? – user6555 Jan 07 '14 at 17:49
  • One: No, because 5 damage is not enough to kill a 7/7 with no damage. Two: One 5/5 will take 5 damage and die, one 5/5 will take two damage and survive, the Ogre will take 10 damage and die. – ikegami Jan 07 '14 at 17:55